The Music Business Buddy
A podcast that aims to educate and inspire music creators in their quest to achieving their goals by gaining a greater understanding of the business of music. A new episode is released each Wednesday and aims to offer clarity and insight into a range of subjects across the music industry. The series includes soundbites and interviews with guests from all over the world together with commentary and clarity on a range of topics. The podcast is hosted by award winning music industry professional Jonny Amos.
Jonny Amos is the author of The Music Business for Music Creators (Routledge/ Focal Press, 2024). He is also a music producer with credits on a range of major and independent labels, a songwriter with chart success in Europe and Asia, a senior lecturer at BIMM University UK, a music industry consultant and an artist manager.
www.jonnyamos.com
The Music Business Buddy
Episode 65: What Happens When Music Collides with the Creator Economy?
Are we witnessing the death of the influencer age? The creator economy is rapidly evolving, and musicians who understand these shifts can position themselves for sustainable success beyond streaming revenues alone.
The landscape has dramatically changed since the TikTok boom of 2020-2021, when seven and eight-figure deals were being offered before artists even met with label executives. Today, labels are taking a more measured approach, focusing on where artists might be in three, five, or ten years rather than trying to capitalise on fleeting viral moments.
This shift coincides with changing audience preferences. The SXSW London Changemaker Report reveals that younger generations increasingly reject overproduced content in favour of authentic, DIY approaches. "Polished content is likely to be questioned in terms of its authenticity, with viewers gauging lo-fi content as more credible," notes the report. This preference extends beyond music into all content creation, suggesting a fundamental rethinking of what constitutes "premium" content.
For music creators, the implications are profound. Many successful artists now develop parallel income streams through non-musical content on platforms like YouTube, with some earning six to seven-figure incomes from cooking shows, shopping videos, or simple video diaries that run alongside their musical careers. As I bluntly state in this episode, "the economic answers are not in music streaming. That's the grown-up truth."
The evolution toward Web3 technologies and decentralised platforms offers another frontier, potentially creating ecosystems that support creators with greater ownership and control. The question becomes not whether music defines you—it does—but how you connect authentically with audiences through multiple channels while maintaining your creative integrity.
Subscribe to Music Business Buddy for weekly insights that help you navigate this rapidly changing landscape and build a sustainable career on your own terms.
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Hello and a very warm welcome to you. You're listening to the Music Business Buddy with me, Jonny Amos, podcasting out of Birmingham in England. I'm the author of the book the Music Business for Music Creators, available in hardback paperback and e. In England. I'm the author of the book the Music Business for Music Creators, available in hardback, paperback and ebook format. I'm a music creator with a variety of credits. I'm a consultant, an artist manager and a senior lecturer in both music business and music creation. Wherever you are, whatever you do, consider yourself welcome to this podcast and to a part of the community around it.
Speaker 1:I'm here to try and educate and inspire music creators from all over the world in their quest to achieving their goals by gaining a greater understanding of the business of music. Okay, so in this week's episode I am talking about the creator economy and also how the landscape has kind of shifted a little bit, even just throughout this decade that we're in so far. So let's just start off real simple by defining what the creator economy is. If it is a fairly new term for you. The creator economy is a digital ecosystem where individuals monetize their content, skills and creativity to earn income. So we're talking about places like Substack and TikTok, YouTube, etc. Now, in some of the recent episodes, we've also explored the concept of decentralization through Web3 forms. Right, so the idea of kind of you know, building a following and then moving it into something which is decentralized right so, if we just kind of like park it there for a moment while we think about this, because if the ideal growth pattern for digital creators and music creators is to build something through platforms and then move people away from those, we're looking at is the creator economy and trying to get a better understanding of it, because I have witnessed a few conflicts in this area. Right, let's start with this. Do you remember the role of social media influencers? Now, when I say do you remember, it feels like the present moment that we're in where we are, in a world of social media influencers. I would argue that that is something which has dramatically started to shift.
Speaker 1:Now I evidence this by something that I read recently that really captured my imagination. It was an article written by the team at South by Southwest London. For anybody that doesn't know, South by Southwest London debuted this year and it created a lot of very healthy critical debate, which kind of spawned into various articles that they published into something called the Changemaker Report. It was actually published by South, by Southwest themselves, and I read it and I thought it was absolutely outstanding. There was one particular piece in there which links to the previous point I just made. Let me share it with you.
Speaker 1:Thought starter eight redefining influence and authority. Credibility shifts as audiences seek out new voices of authority. I read this and I thought, wow, this is really starting to kind of change the landscape of what all of this kind of what it means to influence. So it says here I'm going to read this With the next generation adopting authentic DIY content, the creator economy continues to swell, boosted by platforms including YouTube, including YouTube. Furthermore, in an AI age, polished content is likely to be questioned in terms of its authenticity, with viewers gauging lo-fi content as more credible. Okay, now, that is a very, very, very interesting thought. The speakers on this particular panel also explored ideas such as the younger generation's preference for content that doesn't look like TV.
Speaker 1:Now I'm just going to pause there for a minute and share a thought with you. Just a few weeks ago, I attended a television and media event. I'm not in that world, but I like to learn more about it. I like to understand what programs are in development and what's being worked on and how they do it and all that kind of stuff. It just feeds into a greater understanding of how the creative industries connect to one another, right, and I sat there and I thought this is all very, very interesting, but it all feels a little bit kind of out of date somehow. I hate to say that. I wish I wasn't saying that, but it did. It felt a little bit like this is how things were done 20 years ago in terms of, like legacy television, right. So if I just leave that thought with you and I share this with you from the same Changemaker report, Legacy TV productions place in the era of the creator economy.
Speaker 1:As YouTube and other social video platforms increasingly become the playground for creators, the role of TV production is coming under scrutiny, with talent now being able to create and produce their own content. Therefore, creators are moving into the executive producer role. Major streamers are already talking directly to content creators who have proven concepts on platforms such as YouTube, with the likes of Sidemen and other creators moving more into the executive producer role rather than necessarily being simply on-screen talent. Now, that seems to me to mirror, perhaps, the evolution of how things worked in television and film. Ok, let's bring it back to music for a minute, because a lot of these thoughts that were coming to my mind triggered a memory that I had from episode 38, where I was talking to Mimi Kamara about the deals that she structures and brokers on behalf of artists with labels. This is something that she said.
Speaker 2:that came into my mind. If I'm comparing 2025 to 2020, the deals are more financially conservative. I will say that I think that at the advent of the TikTok boom, the contracts that were coming out were seven and eight figure deals and the proposals would just be out the door before artists even had an opportunity to sit with any of the executives at the label side.
Speaker 1:Okay, so in that particular moment, mimi and I were talking about the typical kind of things that she sees when structuring and negotiating deals on behalf of artists right, but there's actually another kind of inference that we can build when we link it to the points that I've been talking about in this episode so far. It is perhaps, therefore, a suggestion that we are now past the boom age of influencing as we move into the creator economy and really the difference there is between. We all know that we've seen influencers on social media that don't carry the same amount of influence that they used to. I've seen many artists, and labels as well, spending money on, you know, pushing something through influencers. It might be that we are perhaps starting to peak past that. That certainly falls in line with what Mimi was talking about there. Also, what is the role here of labels? Do they wish to get involved with the future of artists' careers outside of their music? This is also something that Mimi talked about.
Speaker 2:Labels are really making more of an effort to sit down and have these kind of dialogues before even drawing up an idea of what a contract could be. I think this is for the good, because we're talking about building a sustainable business as opposed to pacing a TikTok trend.
Speaker 1:Okay. So perhaps this change and this movement away from the moment of instantaneous, this change and this movement away from the moment of instantaneous, that kind of thinking, means that we are starting to see a shift towards more long form thinking and also more long form content. Let me just skip back to the south by southwest change maker report and share this thought with you. Munya chihuahua discussed the transition that he and many creators are making from short form content to longer form narratives. Now, bear in mind that Munya Chihuahua who's what a great name, by the way, that's his real name, from what I gather. You know he's an actor, he's a comedian, he's a rapper, right? So just just just park that thought there for a minute.
Speaker 2:Let's go back to Mimi again, as I I connect another thought together. I feel now that you're not looking at artists as a commodity anymore and you're really trying to see where we're going to go in three years, in five years, in 10 years.
Speaker 1:Okay, so if that means, then, a move to slightly more long form storytelling, is that then reflected in longer form content rather than the short form content? Right, but also we've got this kind of dual skill set between, let's say, an artist who's also sitting inside of the creator economy outside of music. So let's get some more thoughts on that.
Speaker 2:A lot of people are now being more proactive about what the other ancillary income streams are and not relying just on that big, hefty one-time advance that might be the only money you get from the label for the next three to five years and figuring out well, what else am I going to do to grow my brand and to have income coming along?
Speaker 1:Okay. So to have income come along, it's a very, very important point here, isn't it? I know this, it's not all about money and all that kind of stuff, but you know, to make a living as a music creator is a very, very important goal for so many, many people. So you know, and the answers, sadly, are not in streaming. That's the grown up truth. We know that. You know what came before streaming was piracy, and that was far worse. At least in streaming we have something that recognises intellectual property and works to remunerate it. However, you know unless you're in the absolutely upper echelons and also in terms of how music is being licensed and that there is a trigger point into this subject matter. Let's just hear a little bit more from Mimi on this.
Speaker 2:I have clients who are very active in non-musical content on YouTube while pursuing their musical careers. As reality TV has also kind of shrunken in the last five years.
Speaker 1:Okay, so we started to see that in the UK, you know, a little while back, where reality TV started to shrink a little bit. It certainly started to happen more so in America now. So then is this the age where the younger audience moves away from television into something that doesn't look like television, just like what we read in the Changemaker report. So what does Mimi?
Speaker 2:say about that Content is being just on YouTube and people are watching it okay.
Speaker 1:So if there's any music creators out there thinking, oh god, what else do I have to do? I just want to do music, that's okay. You just have to be creative, don't you? If you are to fit into this creator economy and to take on and absorb some of these ideas and, by the way, you don't have to, nobody has to you don't have to do what you can do whatever you like, but if you are considering this, then it would be useful, therefore, to get some ideas as to the kind of things that people are doing. So we've looked at the example of Munya Chihuahua there from the Changemaker report from South by Southwest London. But what other options are there for music creators? Let's see what Mimi says to this.
Speaker 2:YouTube shows where people are cooking shopping just giving a video diary about their day.
Speaker 1:Okay, so this now falls in line completely with what we've been learning in recent episodes about decentralization and fan engagement. But let's just talk, you know, about numbers for a minute, you know, and that's okay. This is a business show, right? So let's talk a little bit about numbers. You know, what can people expect to earn as a youtuber in the creator economy?
Speaker 2:they're having six to seven figure income streams on that non-musical youtube content and paralleling that with their record deal okay.
Speaker 1:So we're starting to get to some interesting truths here about this paralleling that. Mimi talks about the idea of going that's my music there and that's my entity as a creator over there in the creator economy, and actually there is a difference. Now, it doesn't have to be. It may well be that we start to see deals structured by some of the major conglomerates, by indie record companies, that say, actually we want to kind of go 360. We've done 360 deals before. We know that that didn't really work out the way that a lot of people wanted it to, but what we do know is that there is far more income connected to music outside of music, and that is the age that we're in right now within the creator economy. That is, if we don't just split them out, which is something that actually Mimi encourages with her artists. Now let's just go back to the Changemaker report. I want to share something else with you. Young audiences reject inauthentic content, so creator content is set to soar in popularity as younger generations, already deeply sceptical of AI generated content, reject overly produced shows in favour of a more DIY approach. So this, in turn, is set to have a dramatic impact on what is currently being viewed as premium content. I know there's a lot of information here. By the way, everybody, I'm just trying to chuck a few ideas at you to see what you think about all this. New ecosystems are set to evolve, right. This is another aspect of that same chapter.
Speaker 1:Discussing the Africa-facing side of his business, idris Elba outlined a vision to support African creators through a blockchain financial platform specifically for Africa's creative industries. His ambition is to create a new ecosystem designed to support creators from the region at the start of their production journey, as well as those looking through to marketing to global partners. Now, that exactly falls in line with what Matt Jones from Medallion was talking about recently on the podcast. It also falls in line very much with what Ryan Ouyang, ceo of IYK, was saying recently. This is a Web3 movement everybody towards this new creator economy. Success measurements need a rethink. This is another point. In his keynote, from Vanity to Value, genuine Influence and the Creator Economy's New Era, stevie Johnson, managing Director of Disrupt, implored the industry to embrace new success measurements as the creator economy evolves, looking beyond reach and followers as currency. This was a sentiment that recurred at South by Southwest London, with a measurable outcome of creator partnerships being scrutinised and brands implored to look beyond what they refer to as vanity metrics. This goes right back towards what Mimi was referring to earlier when she said that the shift or the influence around 2020, 2021 on TikTok is not what it once was and it's not as investable as we thought it might have been.
Speaker 1:Okay, so, towards the end of that particular section of the Changemaker Report by South by Southwest London says questions to consider. Will you diversify the platforms and formats that you use, you know, in order to stay agile and resilient in the changing, you know, creator economy? And how will you encourage risk and experimentation? So creating, adapt current formats to embrace a more diy approach? Are you ready to provide tailored support for talent? Will you champion fair play? How much are you willing to empower creators? Remember that the creative people respond to creative freedom, right. So loosening the leash and getting better partnerships you know there's a lot to think about there, everybody. So that's just a little snapshot view really of the creator economy, what we've learned from south by southwest london. I must credit them there for their outstanding changemaker report.
Speaker 1:I really enjoyed reading it. That had a lot of substance to it, and the other overriding thought to come out of this is just to think about how you want to position yourself as a music creator, right? Music is the thing that defines you, isn't it? That's why you're listening to me in this very very moment, because you create music and you want it to define your legacy. And you create music and you want it to define your legacy, and I can't think of a single reason in the world as to why that can't happen. It just might mean that you have to think about the other things that connect you as a person to other people, and how you monetize that through creative thinking.
Speaker 1:Ok, that's enough from me. Today Left you with a few things to marinate in your mind. Don't overthink about it, everybody. Sometimes the answers are glaringly simple, once we've had time to kind of go over some of the complexities. Anyway, I will leave you to it. Wish you a great day and until next time, may the force be with you. The Music Business Party. The Music Business Party.
