Episode 83: How Ryan Dickinson Creates and Curates Music For Global Brands

Great music doesn’t have to start from scratch every time. We sat down with Ryan Dickinson, Creative Director at made by ikigai, to unpack how he creates brand-defining music for Adidas, Nike, Samsung, and beyond—without losing the human spark that makes a piece unforgettable. Ryan’s approach starts with clarity: deep questioning, grabbing storyboards, and, when possible, a quick call to surface what clients actually mean. Then he puts sound to picture early. By cutting rough edits that hit narrative beats, he replaces guesswork with evidence and turns subjective taste into a shared decision.

The heart of his system is a modern, composer-led production model. Instead of vanishing into playlist rabbit holes, Ryan works from a curated in-house music catalogue sourced from top composers worldwide. If a track fits, he adapts it. If it inspires, he briefs the same composer for a targeted custom version. That flexibility is a lifeline when more options are needed, timelines shrink, and teams still need music that feels intentional. It also keeps deals simple and fair: evenly splitting the licence fee with composers, recognising that half the value is the art and half is placing it where it belongs.

We also dig into AI—where it helps and where it falls flat. Ryan treats AI like a drum machine preset or a sample pack: useful for seeds, never the song. Taste, restraint, and curation remain the difference between generic and great. His next chapter focuses on giving the catalog its own brand and building tech that speeds up search and auditioning without diluting human craft. If you care about sonic identity, creative process, and fair outcomes for composers, this conversation offers practical ideas you can use today.

Enjoyed this conversation? Follow the show, share it with a friend who makes or licenses music, and leave a quick review to help more creators find us.

https://www.madebyikigai.com

Chapters

• 0:12 Welcome And Guest Introduction
• 2:35 The Meaning Of Ikigai
• 4:11 Decoding Client Needs
• 8:25 Referencing With An In‑House Catalog
• 12:24 Cutting Music To Picture
• 14:40 Between Library And Bespoke
• 18:58 The Life Of Unused Demos
• 23:18 AI As A Tool, Not A Creator
• 27:52 Budgets, Licensing, And Flexibility
• 31:08 Composer Deals And Fair Splits

Transcript

SPEAKER_00: 0:12

Hello everybody and a very warm welcome to you. You're listening to the Music Business Buddy with me, Johnny Amos, podcasting out of Birmingham in England. I'm the author of the book, The Music Business for Music Creators, available in hardback, paperback and ebook format. I'm a music creator with a variety of credits. I'm a consultant, an artist manager, and a senior lecturer in both music, business and music creation. Wherever you are and whatever you do, consider yourself welcome to this podcast and to a part of this community. I'm here to try and educate and inspire music creators from all over the world in their quest to achieving their goals by gaining a greater understanding of the business of music. Okay, so in this week's episode, I am joined by a brilliant guest by the name of Ryan Dickinson. Ryan heads up a company called Made by Ikaguai, which is a a company that really, really fascinates me. They're a full service uh music agency uh that sits kind of interestingly enough, between kind of production music and uh bespoke music, right? They create a lot of music for uh for brands like Adidas, Samsung, Coke, Nike, uh uh Lexus, Meta, Visa, Amazon, all sorts of different places. Um Ryan is an incredibly impressive guy. Uh Ryan is the creative director uh of Made by Ickiguy. He's a composer, he's a sound designer with decades of industry experience. Um but he runs uh a remote uh business uh in Made by Ickiguy in its current incarnation. Um but he deals with hundreds of composers all over the world and uh really is one of I think one of the most outstanding leaders of understanding the nuances of how music aids a sonic identity for a brand, right? I think he's absolutely outstanding at it. And I really wanted to get him on here and just kind of pick his brains and get to understand how he does what he does, what his processes are, uh what his deals are like, that kind of thing. Um it was a riveting conversation. I hope you enjoy it, and I'm gonna hand over to the interview now. Ryan, welcome to the music business buddy. Uh it's good to have you here. How are you?

SPEAKER_02: 2:13

Thanks, Johnny. Yeah, good mate. Nice to be here.

SPEAKER_00: 2:15

Good man. Can I can I just say, well, this is not the scheduled first question, but I really love the name of your organization, right? Um made by Ikigai. Um, I am familiar with that term, it's one of my uh my favorite uh philosophies, but for anybody that doesn't know about it, do you want to explain what it means?

SPEAKER_02: 2:35

Uh yeah, it's uh it's a Japanese concept, and uh I think the easiest way to explain it is kind of almost like visually, it's uh you'd have four circles that overlap each other, and one of them is what you're passionate about, one of them is what you're good at, one of them is what the world needs, and one of them is what you can make a living from. So where they all converge, those four things is your icky guy. So it's not your it's not your passion, it's it's not your hobby, it's not your job, it's kind of like your life purpose. It's the thing you get up every day to do, you love doing it, but you also can make a living from doing it.

SPEAKER_00: 3:12

That's brilliant. I love that. I love that it it applies to so many different things as well, doesn't it? It certainly, you know, applies to good people like yourself, but it also applies to like um, I don't know, um a border collie, right? A sheepdog. Yeah, yeah. Have their purpose in life, you know. They don't get paid. Well, they get fed, I suppose.

SPEAKER_02: 3:32

Um yeah, my wife and I have this thing where we recognize when we're at a location of any kind, whether that's a a bakery or uh uh Airbnb or any kind of different place where we we sort of say to each other, you know, or that person is really is or is not living their icky guy. So if they're if they're if they look really unhappy in their day-to-day work, we sort of just say to each other, oh, well they're definitely not living their icky guy here. And then if someone's just gushing passion and they just absolutely can see they're just so joyful in what they're doing, whatever that is, then we say, Wow, they're definitely living their icky guy doing this thing here.

SPEAKER_00: 4:09

Yeah, yeah. I love that. I love that. Well, you know, I mean, made by Icky Guy has truly like mastered the art of like providing superbly crafted and and also appropriate music, right, for your for your clients. Uh, but I want to ask you about the discipline of understanding what people want, because that can be difficult sometimes, you know. That discipline of understanding what your client wants um is of paramount importance. How do you go about kind of nailing down like you know, sort of tonal references and absorbing a vision? Like, how do you unpack that idea that somebody has so that you can supply what you do?

SPEAKER_02: 4:46

Well, uh, usually just ask for as much as possible. Uh I sort of test the patience, uh push it as far as I can in terms of um I'll always ask for a chat if that's a thing that's possible, but it it isn't always possible. So I always find you find you get a lot a lot of information that they didn't know they had, and um, and and just you uncover a lot of uh tidbits and ideas and right roads and wrong roads by just having a human conversation. So that's always the the best course of action if possible. But in the day we live in now and the time frame that people have on jobs, that's not often that possible. In those cases, I tend to ask a lot of questions on email, uh, ask for any assets, even back to the original storyboards. And then on the music tip specifically, it varies. People sometimes have a very, very clear idea of what they want, and what they might have nailed down a very specific music reference uh that ticks all the boxes uh for the project but doesn't meet the budget needs, or there's another reason they can't use it. Other times they're a little bit more broad in what they're after, and in those cases, I'll do some music referencing myself. In the olden days, not the olden days, but say in my previous jobs, I probably more would have gone to Spotify, um, just going down rabbit holes of searching for music and finding playlists and making playlists to see what sort of sticks, what feels good. Nowadays I actually end up using our own music catalog as my referencing because it means that if something is actually nailed, if if someone really loves something, then it's then we can use it. Um it can also mean that if they narrow down to a handful of songs they like, that automatically tells me the composers that I'd like to get on the job if it is if it is a bespoke composition job. Um then it gives me a pretty clear idea. If they love, you know, these if they love four tracks and two of them are from one composer, then of course I'm gonna go to that person and ask them to make a very specific composition for the job that we're on. And that's probably been the more because I've invested so much energy and time into the catalogue and it and it's of such quality now, that's really the way that I go about referencing for projects. I don't really go down Spotify holes anymore. I tend to reach our catalogue first and see where we go if nothing sticks, and of course we can always go down uh other paths of of release music to find things that are um of interest. But I tend to find clients have um their own references when they come to us, and that's a good jumping off point.

SPEAKER_00: 7:31

Ah, okay, interesting. It's so cool that you can reference your own catalogue, you know, when a catalogue has got that much depth and scope to it, you know, that's really, really useful because, you know, sometimes it can be difficult, right, to kind of figure out what people want when they think they know what they want, but really it's something slightly different. Um, I love that idea about like I know it's not always possible, but like jumping on a call and just going, can I just check is this what you meant? Yeah, that is what I meant. Brilliant, all right, I'll leave you to it. You know, or no, I didn't mean that part of it, I mean that part of it. Right, good job we spoke then, you know.

SPEAKER_02: 8:07

Yeah, you can save yourself a lot of time by just having a conversation, I find. So I always ask for one where possible. Um, and another thing I tend to do if they do have a working reference is rather than just send um tracks uh as on their own in a in a playlist of any kind, I try to do rough edits of music to the pictures so we can actually see it working to the pictures. I find it's a very good uh auditioning method. Um, when you when you watch something and hear something at the same time, rather than imagine the things working together, it it really breaks down and lets you see it working, and especially if it's edited to the points, you know, in the storyline, kind of hitting the notes to a degree. I find that's a really uh valuable referencing method that that that I've come across in the last few years.

SPEAKER_00: 8:55

Yeah, that's that's a good point. Yeah, seeing is believing sometimes.

SPEAKER_02: 8:59

Yeah, yeah. Leave less than the imagination.

SPEAKER_00: 9:04

Um one of the things that really fascinates me about what you've built is where you're positioned in the marketplace because you're kind of uniquely positioned between uh, you know, sort of library/slash production music and also bespoke composition. Um, do you find that you kind of sometimes have existing catalogue that has always kind of held potential but never quite found its success home yet, you know, its success point, and therefore you kind of find something that can then be reworked?

SPEAKER_02: 9:35

Yeah, 100%. I mean, that's what the catalogue is built on. Um back in my time at Massive Music, of course, every big music agency has internal libraries of um, you know, they call them different things, dead demos or uh yeah, just trick tracks that were being created for a project and were not selected for that project. And oftentimes, as a creative director, the ones that I thought were the best suited for the project weren't the ones that got selected. So I knew there was just tons of really great music just sitting there. And whenever I got a brief at my time at um, say massive, I would always go through the internal library as well as brief composers. So I had I could be sort of taking my fate into my own hands while I waited a few days for compositions to come back. I could just see if I could find something that worked, recraft it to the pictures, and I was actually finding a lot of success with doing that. Um, and that sometimes the existing tracks were beating the even the newly composed ones. And that was sometimes not necessarily just on quality, but maybe that the one we found was in a slightly different direction that no one had really thought about. And um, they had a little aha moment, you know, it's like, oh wow, we never thought to go that direction with it. And when you're getting bespoke composers, you generally really have to narrow down very specifically what they're after because you're paying for someone in the studio for the day, you don't have that many shots at it. So you really want to be specific about what you're asking the composer to make. Whereas when you start going through existing compositions, you can start to delve around into different areas as well as try to land it right down the runway as well. Um, and so when I set up Made Wakey Guy, I knew that having an internal resource of kind of ready-to-go demos uh was going to be a really important thing. And I spent months and months contacting hundreds of composers, uh really well-known media composers around the world, and just rounding up non-exclusively, the tracks that they'd composed that hadn't got hadn't found a home as yet. And that's really ended up being uh the majority of what our company has been doing for the last year. Um, uh, these are great pieces of music, they're fully adaptable and uh they're ready to go. And uh what I love, one of my my personal icky guys is is recrafting things, reshaping things. And I found that I mean, I was a music composer for many years, uh, but remixing things was something I loved doing as a composer, as a uh releasing dance music, and also as a sound designer, I worked for many years and cutting cutting tracks to pictures uh was something that I really loved doing. So just kind of honing in on that very specific Ike guy of my own uh was something that uh I knew I had a very good uh skill set at doing that. And I knew that when it doesn't matter when the track was composed, people don't really mind where it comes from or what it is, as long as it sounds and works, sounds good, works well for the film that they're they're making. So absolutely, uh we haven't been running for very long, so the internal um unused demos of actual bespoke projects we've worked on is very small, but the catalogue is very large of tracks that composers have made uh in the last few months and years uh in their freelance time.

SPEAKER_00: 12:55

That's superb. I love that because you know there's so many, uh as you well know, Ryan, you know, there's so many composers that bore this time into something, and then all of a sudden you go, Oh, that that's not worked. And you could I speak to composers sometimes that'll feel a bit despondent about it, and I'll say, hang on, the life of a copyright is a strange and long thing, right? You know, sometimes something you did 20 years ago can find huge relevance 10 years from this moment, you know. Um, I was talking to uh I spoke over the last few months on the podcast, I spoke to uh a few different music publishers, and they were talking about really the same thing, but just from the perspective of song pitching to um record companies, and um and you know, the amount of times they've taken old library and then it's it just changed like kicks and snares and synth presets, and all of a sudden bang, you know, it's become a hit record. Um it's just you know, uh a good idea is always a good idea in one way or another.

SPEAKER_02: 13:53

Yeah, I mean, if you if a piece of music has been made with uh love and uh skill, it doesn't matter when that was, it doesn't matter if it was three weeks ago, one year ago, or 15 years ago, I guess, you know, when when you go back far enough, then it starts to have a certain sound to it, which can be a good thing. Uh, but you know, if we talk about a handful of years, uh there's no way you're gonna know whether it was written yesterday or or or two years ago, to be honest.

SPEAKER_00: 14:25

No, no, that's uh that's a good point. Um so as you know, as a as a as a company, you are you are like a you know a human first with your with your craft. Uh but I just wondered what your views were on using AI at the point of ideation. Um, if the rest of the process beyond that is kind of human-made, uh, because it's something that I'm starting to witness uh a lot more recently, just to kind of you know that initial process, rather than kind of you know creating something with prompts, for example, but more so kind of like just maybe using like new Ableton's new sort of tools or whatever to kind of like generate seeds and rhythms and things to then go, is that good? Should we spend time on that? You know, is that something that you're witnessing at the moment?

SPEAKER_02: 15:08

Uh I mean it's but it's potentially something that the composers, the freelance composers that work for us use as tools within their box. Uh that idea is not new. Uh using sample packs has been around for a long time. As a composer myself, I I use them, I use them a lot. Um it's it's it's what you do with them, it's how you combine them, it's how you reshape them, it's um finding interesting ways to combine things. So I I do view uh AI can be viewed as something we've had for a very long time already. Um it's at the point where it it creates something entirely, you know, without too much human input and just a few words uh popping out that you tend to get quite generic sounding things. Um the idea of using it as a tool, I think every composer will use it, and and it's not a new concept if we look at the idea of sampling things, um, which has been around for a very long time now. Uh people have been willing, and and even considering something like a drum machine, uh you you can go flip through presets on a drum machine and find some inspiring drum pattern, and then it's what you do with that, uh with your human creativity and taste and curation and deciding what layers to add is is what is the interesting part of uh a human making music to me.

SPEAKER_00: 16:37

Yeah, well, I absolutely love that answer you just gave because um I kind of find myself nodding along because a lot of the things that you've just said there and the things that I say to other people, and I say, look, there's kind of like there's kind of nothing new about a lot of the things that we're talking about because we've had MIDI since the early 80s, right? Uh sampling, as you say, has been around for a long time, and um and the idea of kind of you know something generative or or something that you know uses randomization or probability, you know, there's nothing new about that at all. Um, and and sometimes uh the you know the sort of rebadging of it can can be confusing and needlessly offensive, let's say, you know.

SPEAKER_02: 17:19

Um yeah, I think our jobs more and more with AI coming in, with with generative things coming in and just endless possibilities, even more than there were before. Our job more and more becomes curators using taste and and and interesting combinations of things and and and also what you don't put into things, strip how you strip things back. And um I think as human creators, that's going to become more and more our jobs is is is curators.

SPEAKER_00: 17:50

Right. Well great way of framing it. Love that. Um what about on the uh the music supervision and the licensing side of things? Have you noticed any changes in the landscape in sort of recent times?

SPEAKER_02: 18:03

So uh on the licensing side, uh I've never been heavily involved in licensing release music through labels, for instance, uh a few projects here and there, but that's never been specifically my world. Um but I do speak to a lot of people out there, a lot of producers, a lot of directors and creatives. Um I'd say probably the biggest shift, but it's not a new one, is is budget shrinking. But as that becomes more of a thing, it it starts to um restrict certain areas and and choices. And what I found is the budgets uh sort of getting now to the point, not always, but definitely on more projects than before, where they they didn't have the kind of base level of money that it would need for a conventional bespoke composition uh project, which involves demo fees, sometimes you know quite quite a lot of demo fees, a fairly healthy win fee to get talent to get into the studio for a day uh or two to work on projects. And that's where the catalog that we've been working on being so adaptive is really filling a bit of a void between library music and bespoke compositions because it is a bespoke composition, um, and we're able to give many options uh and quickly. Um, and we don't need to pay people to go into the studio already because they've they've already done that time. Uh it also means I'm able to be a little bit more um well, with the composer, we're able to be a little bit more flexible on pricing because I'm I'm not requesting someone to go and put in eight to sixteen hours of work for a number. You know, the the track exists already, so um it's just extra money in the pocket as long as we're talking non exclusive.

SPEAKER_00: 19:58

Yeah, yeah. That's That's so clever. I'm really fascinated by where you've kind of positioned yourself there. It's so clever. It's um yeah, well done. You you're you're a clever dude, Ryan. Um now you work, you know, obviously on a remote basis, right, with hundreds of composers from all over the world. What is your approach to kind of structuring deals with composers?

SPEAKER_02: 20:26

Uh it's a pretty simple one, actually. Uh I just split 50-50 the license fee on the track. So whatever we agree with the uh agency that the final fee is for the music, um, I tell that number to the composer and 50% of that is theirs. And nice. Nice and that it we just keep it nice and simple. Um I've I've because I've worked as a composer myself for many years, um, I've also been on the other side within larger music agencies as a creative director. I've seen it from both sides, I've seen many different deal structures across many different countries, and I've seen things I do and don't like. And um the fairest deal that I've found um is this one of the an even split. Of course, when you get to actually uh like a sync licensor working for a release piece of music, then it would be a lesser percentage than that. But when we're in a bespoke world, a 50-50 split is as good as I've ever seen. And that was the deal that I wanted to make sure that was available to anyone that works with us. Um, just because it's fair. I believe that half is the art and half is finding a home and a um uh uh a a payday for that art. Uh and I think the two things are uh go hand in hand. You can't have one without the other in order to you know make some money in in the world we are off of the art. Yeah. So yeah, trying to keep it simple.

SPEAKER_00: 21:55

Good for you, man. Good for you. It's the best way. I think um uh it's refreshing to hear that because that is a good deal, right? Um, it is a fair deal and it's very, very simple to understand for people. So uh yeah, I love anything like that. It makes a lot of sense to me. Um may I finally ask you um about your about your background and what led you to here because you've you know you've uh you've alluded to it, you know, already uh in the last few minutes about some of the roles that you've played in other companies, and you know, I think you you have obviously have a very, very informed understanding of how to position you know made by Ike Guy based upon some of those experiences. So what was that path for you? Uh I know it's a big question, by the way, Ryan. So feel free to summarise as much as you wish.

SPEAKER_02: 22:41

But yeah, we could take on the full 45 minutes with that.

SPEAKER_00: 22:45

When I've when I when I kind of thought about this question, I thought, oh, it's a bit unfair that, because it's like it's a massive question. But um, what what did it look like for you from kind of like from the very very early onset into you know starting in this world to where you are now? What does that path look like on a sort of you know summarized level?

SPEAKER_02: 23:02

Yeah, on a con a condensed version uh would be that uh after quite a few years in um different bands and um releasing different styles of music. Uh there was a duo that uh electronic duo that was I was in released an album. Um of course didn't didn't do much, and we we hadn't made much money in any way, shape, or form across many years of of releasing and and and playing gigs, obviously some, but nothing too meaningful. Um we had a track from that album synced on a TV commercial for Australian Air Force by lovely uh folks over at level two music in in Australia, and we had, you know, by the standards I understand now of the industry, uh quite quite a modest sync, you know. It wasn't anything too big, but for for us it was an in a crazy payday compared to anything else we'd ever done. So I'd say, and we got paid, you know, it was it was not um like a royalty-based thing, and uh we'll pay you after X amount of days, after, you know, we've been through a many a record label deal, and those things are got so many layers to them, and at the end you have an Excel document with a thousand uh blocks in it and a minus number at the end of it somehow, no matter what you've done, um, even after millions of streams somehow I found. Uh, but so we had a sync and uh and it worked, and we got paid, and I realized that there was a a good uh world in in advertising in sync um that artists got paid for their art. And that was kind of where I really had a bit of an aha moment and started redirecting my ship in that direction. Um I also after a while um I got out of making music and decided I wanted to work in sound design. It was just kind of like I'd taken six months off, did a bit of soul searching, and realized that I still needed to be in full time working nine to five, Monday to Friday, doing what I love, which I had never done before. I'd always released music and on the side, but had a regular job. So I started working as a sound designer. I worked for a number of years um uh across video games and uh and in advertising across a few different countries. And through there, I was kind of really in the trenches Monday to Friday uh with the creatives and really seeing how an ad came together and also witnessing the music being selected and edited. Um after those years, I moved over to Amsterdam and uh started working with Massive Music as a creative director. And that was the point where I started to learn the I really get in get stuck into the idea of bespoke compositions and working with composers and uh briefing out to composers and speaking with creatives and understanding the concept. And I worked with Massive for about three and a half years across Amsterdam, Singapore, and and Sydney. Um and that brings us to the point where I decided to start Made by Ike Guy. And there's um many, many steps and layers and parts I've left out there, but it's a it's a hyper-condensed version of me from uh uh a music producer into a sound designer, into a creative director, um, which is where we are today.

SPEAKER_00: 26:22

Wow, that's thank you so much. That's quite difficult to have done what you just did there. That's that's do you know one of the well, there's many things that fascinate me about what you just said there, but one of the things that I can't help but wonder is um is what happens next for you because um you know you've done so much, um, you know, and uh you've built something that's really, really special, that's very useful, very successful, um, which speaks volumes about you and about who you choose to work with and and the skills of those people too. But it also then makes me think, wow, what next? Because um, you know, you've you you've become some one that's incredibly useful to an incredibly large amount of people.

SPEAKER_02: 27:06

Um yeah, well, uh a lot is coming next. Uh not not all I can go into too much detail at the moment. Um, but yeah, last year was a was a big year on many fronts in being the first year of the company and putting it all together and uh traveling a lot to get the word out and meet with many people. Um and I think up until uh a few months ago, I just assumed it was probably going to be um more of that, but maybe a little bit more on the chilled side because I really went hard in the first year. And now working with uh software developers, two different software developing teams on different um things for the internal back end of the company to help running with that that side of things. But then uh the more interesting part is is working with our catalog and uh some tools that I think are going to be really useful for the industry, um, which I can't go into too much at the moment, and we haven't cracked it yet. Okay. Uh, but but it it's gonna be really focusing a lot on the catalog, and I'm gonna be giving that a life of its own uh in this year and giving it a brand of its own. Um, I'd say around about midway through this year I'll I'll uh put the word out, assuming that everything stays on track to get there. Um, and then of course, um bringing partners in involved, uh people, more people in the company to to help um in different uh areas around the globe. Uh there's only so many places I can be in at once, and we have a fantastic network of freelance talent. But I think in the in the day-to-day runnings of the of the company, uh it will be something that I I feel this year, when the right person, the right uh conversation happens, we'll start to expand to have more people on a on uh a full-time basis focused on getting the word out there and running projects alongside me. Um but yeah, keep an eye on this space. Uh this year will be um um uh a year of of something else coming into the world that should be quite memorable, I hope.

SPEAKER_00: 29:20

Wow, okay, okay. It's not human cloning, is it? Because you could probably do with about 10 more Ryan Dickinsons, that would solve a lot of problems, wouldn't it?

SPEAKER_02: 29:29

Well, but I mean then the idea of human is is definitely something that is at the at the backbone of it. You know, I'm I'm not really interested in exploring generative AI as something that is going to create the arts. Of course, as we discussed earlier, um using those tools to assist us and help with ideation and things like that, of course, that's fine. But um making sure that human-made music is something that um we put at the forefront of what we do, uh, really focus on that and the human craft and human curation, but then letting technology assist us in other areas that can help um speed up many other parts of what we do is something that I'm really interested in. And um, I mean, I think everyone needs to be thinking about that in whatever industry they're in at the moment. Uh so I've been putting a lot of my thought time into that for the last uh six to twelve months, and and I think I've come up with something that could really be helpful for uh uh me firstly and then uh many other people, hopefully after that.

SPEAKER_00: 30:34

Wow, okay. This is gonna be a good episode to listen back on in a few months and go, oh, that was what he did.

SPEAKER_02: 30:41

Okay. Hopefully, hopefully. Still gonna make it first, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 30:46

Well, that's the fun bit sometimes, I guess. But um Ryan, you're a top guy. I really appreciate you talking to me today. Um, I send you all the luck in the world for all of your projects, all of your ideas going forward. Um, and I look forward to you know following your story and seeing how it all unfolds. And and thank you for joining me. Good luck, man. Thanks so much, Johnny.

SPEAKER_02: 31:10

Yeah, I really appreciate the chat, and thanks for the kind words, and uh keep doing what you're doing as well. It's uh great to uh have interesting conversations and get knowledge out there for for the the wider creative community.

SPEAKER_00: 31:23

It certainly is, and uh and Ryan made that happen here today in this episode. Really, really top guy. I know I've said this before, everybody, but have you ever noticed something here, right? Is that these really, really top-level people are very good people, right? Ryan's another fine example of that. Um, you know, he he as he talked about in the interview, he's played a lot of different roles, you know, in the industry over the years and made himself very, very useful to a lot of people because of how hard working he is, as well as being talented. But I also think not only about what he's done and where he's at now, but where he's going to next, um, because I think big things lie ahead for him. And he could only softly allude to it there in that interview, but it would be nice to check back in with him uh in the future because uh it'd be really, really, really interesting to follow his story and to see where made by Ickiguy goes next and see where Ryan Dickinson goes next. Um he's a man of the now, a man of the moment, and a man of the future, and on top of that, he's a thorough gent. Uh okay, that's enough from me today. Have a great day, everybody, and may the force be with you.

SPEAKER_01: 32:29

The music business party. The music, business party.